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目标片段是可以通过市场整合团结全球工人,这对于社会主义国际至关重要。
来源片段It also has the added bonus of uniting the workers of the world through market integration, which is going to be key for socialist internationalism.

相似度 0.794 · Past, Present & Future · Ideas of Globalisation: Trade, Race and Empire (and Trump!) · 目标 14:39–14:46 · 来源 18:19–18:27

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  1. S1:2 个窗口回退
    1. S1来源 6:23–7:01目标 5:29–6:030.736

      来源片段

      This is what inspires the anti-corn law league and Britain, this kind of middle-class grassroots pressure group to try to overturn these protective tariffs on foreign grain in Britain. This is in part because Britain is rapidly industrializing way more than its rivals at this time, but this is also meaning a great amount of urbanization. And so you have a lot of workers living in British metropoles that are quite poor and starving. And so one of the ways that the anti-corn law league is able to tap into this issue is to say, why don't we get rid of the protective tariffs on foreign grain on food? That way we can have cheap food flooding into England from all over the world and we can make sure that everybody can afford to put food on the table, the so-called cheap loaf.

      目标片段

      股物法案是英国在19世纪初通过的保护主义法律,主要目的是为了保护英国农业,特别是粮食生产股物法案规定,如果外国股物价格低于一定标准,那么英国国内股物市场就会受到保护,他们就会开始对外国来的粮食征收高额关税,目的是为了确保英国农业利益,特别是那些从事农业的贵族、大地主和大农民19世纪初的英国,正在经历快速工业化城市人口迅速增加。这些新兴的工人阶级和中产阶级对于粮食价格上涨感到极为不满,因为股物法案的存在,确实导致粮食价格变高了,

    2. S1来源 6:41–7:16目标 5:59–6:320.717

      来源片段

      This is in part because Britain is rapidly industrializing way more than its rivals at this time, but this is also meaning a great amount of urbanization. And so you have a lot of workers living in British metropoles that are quite poor and starving. And so one of the ways that the anti-corn law league is able to tap into this issue is to say, why don't we get rid of the protective tariffs on foreign grain on food? That way we can have cheap food flooding into England from all over the world and we can make sure that everybody can afford to put food on the table, the so-called cheap loaf. And so this connection between industrialization and food security is a really important element here that's I think taking into account this globalized world that's coming into being as global food market system even that's coming into existence.

      目标片段

      这些新兴的工人阶级和中产阶级对于粮食价格上涨感到极为不满,因为股物法案的存在,确实导致粮食价格变高了,外国来的便宜,粮食没有办法进入英国市场,让那些急速增长的城市人口吃到便宜的粮食,对吧?那些工人的生活条件是很差的,他们对于粮食价格非常敏感。虽然说股物法案保护了农民,但是它让数量不断增加的城市工业生产者,工人生活成本增加,导致这个城市居民和工人,

  2. S1来源 7:56–8:23目标 7:50–8:110.665

    来源片段

    And so this is what's happening in the 1840s and it's this really fascinating connection between domestic reform, food security, and taking into account industrialization as well as this foreign policy implication of potentially a much freer, more integrated world order. When the people who wanted to repeal the Corn Laws imagined this free trading economy in which grain would be cheaper, did they think of it in global terms?

    目标片段

    横更在这个国家,每个人生活当中的粮食法案,显然与这个自由贸易的理念是相互冲撞、互相违背的。于是我们来到了这段历史的起点1840年代左右的时候,英国爆发了一场由工人阶级和中产阶级联合发起的运动叫做Anti-Corn Law League.

  3. S1:2 个窗口回退
    1. S1来源 14:26–15:00目标 9:58–10:330.751

      来源片段

      And so for them, the way that they were able to connect free trade with this panacea of democratization, cheap food, prosperity, even job growth, I think considering that the British were the leading industrial power, the idea, of course, would be that more of these jobs that would be created would probably be happening within these industrial centers rather than out in the British farms. But thinking about the fact that the aristocrats were the ones that own most of that land that was being used for farming made that less of an issue in Britain, at least, than it might be in other parts of the world. Is it possible to say that free trade in this period in the middle of the 19th century was a populist cause? Because now we are now living in an age where tariffs are the cause of the populists. It's more complicated than that. And there are lots of variations on this theme.

      目标片段

      这种自由主义一开始的不诚实,导致现在很多自由主义的拥趸,绝大多数今天的这些跳来跳去的知识分子,不相信这套体系可能会出现loser.所以自然而然的会认为,对于这套体系心生不满的人都是非蠢极坏。在19世纪的英国,自由贸易者把自由贸易塑造成的是城市中产阶级和工人阶级运动。他的敌人一开始是谁?一开始是在英国拥有大部分土地的贵族。他们能够通过对外国粮食征收保护性关税,让自己赚更多钱。自由贸易者一开始想要削弱的是这群人的影响力。

    2. S1来源 14:54–15:34目标 11:11–11:470.677

      来源片段

      Because now we are now living in an age where tariffs are the cause of the populists. It's more complicated than that. And there are lots of variations on this theme. But as you describe it, if you go back 175 years, free trade is the slogan, the banner, the organizing principle of the people who are claiming to stand up for ordinary people against elites, to stand up for the workers against the people who are exploiting or gouging the workers. Is it too much to call that a form of populism? It was by and large a middle class movement. And they attempted to, and to some degrees, were successful in getting the working class, drawing out this kind of populist dimension to it.

      目标片段

      早期自由贸易的拥顿是一个民粹左派,主张,目的是为了削弱贵族的权利,削弱贵族在外交政策影响中的影响力。在175年前,我们去看那些最嘹亮的在曼切斯特这种英国大城市新兴的工业城市,拿着国富论鼓吹自由贸易的人,他们的口号是什么?普通人对抗精英工人对抗工人的剥削者。虽然说民粹在很多人心中是一个贬义词,但是我想让大家放下你心中对他的贬义。民粹的字面意思是什么?普通人polis对抗精英elite,所有民粹主义都包含着这种普通人人民和精英的对立。自由贸易。

  4. S1来源 15:28–15:40目标 11:50–12:010.645

    来源片段

    It was by and large a middle class movement. And they attempted to, and to some degrees, were successful in getting the working class, drawing out this kind of populist dimension to it.

    目标片段

    它就是用一种普通人对抗精英对抗贵族的民粹主张。那个时候的普通人是新兴的中产阶级,并且试图把工人阶级也拉进来,让他们参与其中。

  5. S1来源 16:34–16:44目标 12:10–12:230.675

    来源片段

    leader of the anti-corn law league, Richard Cobden, the so-called apostle free trade, we call Cobdenism. There's a reason why these are happening in these, these metropoles like Manchester.

    目标片段

    曼切斯特学派,有时候他们也被叫做科布登主义。科布登就是反古物法联盟的领袖Richard Coppton他是一个带着民粹色彩的自由主义,

  6. S1:2 个窗口回退
    1. S1来源 16:56–17:33目标 13:29–14:000.754

      来源片段

      But I think it's an underappreciated moment here too, when these liberal radical capitalist ideas about free trade start percolating and I think influencing Marxist internationalism at the same exact time that this is all happening too. So yeah, the fact that Frederick Ingalls is living in Manchester, England in the early 1840s, and Karl Marx joins him soon thereafter in the 1840s. And that's exactly when Marx and Ingalls start developing their endorsement, or at least halfway endorsement of free trade as the next small, progressive step in capitalist development, getting us closer to the socialist revolution. It's more than coincidental that these are enunciated in the 1840s while they're living in Britain during this, this free trade agitation.

      目标片段

      为什么大家不要忘了我刚才说的自由派,当时企图拉拥工人阶级,搞反对贵族的阶级斗争,这套运动这是什么?这是什么?这是推动社会层面的全球革命?大家猜一下1840年的曼切斯特,英国还住着哪个大人物,还住着恩格斯。恩格斯那个时候他就住在曼切斯特,对吧?在1840年的后半段,他还把自己的好哥们马克思也搞过来了。这两个人在1840年就在曼切斯特大街上葛那儿讨论,我们要支持自由贸易。

    2. S1来源 17:13–17:48目标 13:43–14:150.758

      来源片段

      So yeah, the fact that Frederick Ingalls is living in Manchester, England in the early 1840s, and Karl Marx joins him soon thereafter in the 1840s. And that's exactly when Marx and Ingalls start developing their endorsement, or at least halfway endorsement of free trade as the next small, progressive step in capitalist development, getting us closer to the socialist revolution. It's more than coincidental that these are enunciated in the 1840s while they're living in Britain during this, this free trade agitation. So again, this is still influencing more intellectual circles, middle class intellectual circles, but with important connotations for a more populist idea that could come out of that. And so yeah, the Marx and Ingalls endorsement of free trade, Marx gives this speech in 1848 on free trade.

      目标片段

      大家猜一下1840年的曼切斯特,英国还住着哪个大人物,还住着恩格斯。恩格斯那个时候他就住在曼切斯特,对吧?在1840年的后半段,他还把自己的好哥们马克思也搞过来了。这两个人在1840年就在曼切斯特大街上葛那儿讨论,我们要支持自由贸易。我们要反对古物法案,这两个人就就在那儿。他们是英国自由贸易动荡中的这个知识分子圈中的一员。中产阶级知识分子圈子里面混来混去,并且对自由贸易产生了相当支持的立场。

  7. S1来源 17:57–18:11目标 14:20–14:290.737

    来源片段

    So maybe this gets overshadowed, but I think it's really important to this story that Marx comes out in 1848, saying that we, socialist internationalists, all should be supporters of free trade, because this is where capitalism needs to go.

    目标片段

    马克思在1848年发表了一次有关自由贸易的演讲,明确表示,我们社会主义国际主义者应该支持自由贸易。

  8. S1来源 18:11–18:19目标 14:32–14:390.722

    来源片段

    Protectionism, mercantilism is regressive, it's retrograde, it's slowing down capitalist development, free trade speeds up capitalist development.

    目标片段

    重商主义是倒退的,是阻碍资本主义发展的自由贸易,可以加速资本主义发展附带的好处是什么?

  9. S1来源 18:27–18:56目标 14:58–15:150.619

    来源片段

    And actually, the condemnation that Marx and Ingalls have for the protectionists is remarkably similar to the Manchester School and their connection with protectionism as a sort of violent tool of coercion that ultimately works against the country practicing it, I think in many ways. In other words, there's a really interesting kind of alliance that you can almost see starting to happening in the 1840s in an intellectual level, at least around these ideas of free trade and globalization as they try to tap into this populist dimension.

    目标片段

    这两种谴责惊人的相似,他们的核心论点都是经济保护主义者,对于国家有害,这是一种暴力。所以我相信通过解释,当时1840年左右,英国针对股物法案生长出来滋长出来的。

  10. S1来源 20:44–21:17目标 20:42–21:150.760

    来源片段

    And because of its revolutionary turn, unilateral turn to free trade in 1846, we tend to assume that because they wanted the rest of the world to follow in its free trade tracks, that that's what happened. And this is a remarkable misconception of the decades leading up to the First World War. And as you folks continue to misremember the arguments of people like Norman Angel, warning about the perils of the globalized world and what conflicts would mean, these are all, I think, connected to this misconception. So yeah, to your point, the unilateral turn to free trade, they assumed that people would see the prosperity wrought from this free trade turn and want to get on board.

    目标片段

    英国经济从农业主导转向工业主导,让它成为世界上最发达的工业国家,就是1846年古物法案的废除,让英国成为了世界上第一个实行自由贸易的主要经济体。如果你认为英国这一转向会促使全世界其他国家跟进自由贸易轨迹,导致全球经济普遍自由化,这是错误的。这个假想过于乐观,自由贸易没有在全球范围内在19世纪得到实现。英国期待通过自由贸易开启的繁荣来吸引其他国家加入。但是我们等一会会更加详细的讨论。

  11. S1来源 21:22–21:43目标 21:26–21:430.683

    来源片段

    So the mid-19th century from around 1846 to around 1870, things do seem to be going the free traders way. So you have the 1860 Cobdin-Chevalier Treaty or Anglo-French Treaty that's signed using arguments to say, why instead of preparing for another military conflict with the French, why don't we just try to trade with them instead and try to do this peaceably?

    目标片段

    在这短时间内,比如说在1860年与英国进行贸易的国家,确实受到了英国贸易自由化的影响。在1860年,有一个著名的文件,就是英国和法国签署的科布登谢瓦里耶条约被我们称为1860英法条约。

  12. S1来源 22:07–22:13目标 25:14–25:240.686

    来源片段

    But then, yeah, this is all going to change drastically by the time you get to the early 1870s.

    目标片段

    但是到了1870年发生了什么1870年爆发了经济衰退,全球性的经济衰退,这是19世纪末发生的巨大变化。

  13. S1来源 23:24–23:32目标 26:26–26:370.709

    来源片段

    Including in agriculture, the German economy was in part, German-Prussian economy was in part founded on an idea of protection.

    目标片段

    反而在他的经济中坚持强烈的保护主义,尤其是在农业方面,普鲁士经济的基础部分,就建立在保护主义的理念之上,

  14. S1来源 23:47–24:00目标 26:42–26:540.670

    来源片段

    There are interesting ideas of free trade mingling in there with getting rid of trade barriers between various German states, but also there is ultimately this very, very big tariff wall that's also assumed to be placed against the rest to protect German agriculture, to protect. . .

    目标片段

    在德意志关税同盟中,虽然说消除了各个德意志国家之间的贸易壁垒,商品可以自由流通,但是在外部普鲁士依然保持着强大的关税壁垒,

  15. S1来源 24:24–24:40目标 27:13–27:240.716

    来源片段

    And so it's really interesting to see how a few decades later, free traders in Germany try to do something similar as what the free traders in Britain did along very similar lines of argument, obviously less successfully to your point about the Prussian sticking to protectionism for most of this period. And that point you make is really interesting.

    目标片段

    几十年后,德国的自由贸易者试图做出英国自由贸易者的举动。但是由于普鲁士长期坚持保护主义,这些自由贸易从来都没有像英国这样成功。

  16. S1来源 27:41–28:18目标 27:29–28:010.777

    来源片段

    So this is that is one fear that is being had and is going to be developed in very effective ways in these political circles to oppose British free trade ideas across the late 19th century. But you also see, and I think this is an important connection here, understanding how Britain's imperial rivals are turning to high tariffs and trade wars, this is going to turn some within Britain against the free trade system itself. So you start to have this kind of minority undercurrent, especially amongst conservative circles, again, free trade tends to be a liberal political policy in this period and protectionism, a conservative one. So conservatives in Britain are increasingly becoming more critical of the free trade system, they want to retaliate against Britain's enemies.

    目标片段

    因此,德国的情况从外部看,在一定程度上表现为自由贸易,就是它的内部。这些德意志内部是自由贸易的,但是实际上也呈现出高度的保护主义特点。到了19世纪末,随着英国的各个竞争对手全部都开始搞高关税贸易战。我们开始在英国内部听到了新的反对自由贸易体制的声音。大家记得在19世纪初,反对自由贸易的人是地主贵族。现在这群人通过一个世纪的斗争,已经被打得七零八乱了。我们听到的是全新的反对自由贸易的声音。这些人开始提出了一个新的概念,那就是在free trade自由贸易之上,我们要fair trade,

  17. S1来源 32:25–32:43目标 28:06–28:180.656

    来源片段

    So it's not the fault of free trade, it's the fault of the people who didn't see the light. Yeah, I mean, and I think this goes to this wider tension that encompasses all this as well as much as the 20th and as we're saying the 21st century, this contestation between nationalism and internationalism, that's playing out in an economic way here that we're discussing.

    目标片段

    现在这个自由贸易并不公平。所以说我们在19世纪末一直到一战20世纪初的世界大战,我们看到的反而是关税和保护主义的重新崛起。

  18. S1来源 46:57–47:27目标 29:14–29:330.747

    来源片段

    I mean Joseph Chamberlain is a really good case in point here of somebody who began as a liberal politician and a free trader but famously also mayor of Birmingham and seeing how the rival protectionist industrial powers have caught up and are even overtaking the British certain areas that is part of the reason why he shifts to an imperial trade preferential vision for the empire and retaliation, tariff retaliation. This is certainly happening in the late 19th century towards the tail end for somebody like him.

    目标片段

    你可以说很多时候就是那些明明受益过自由贸易,受益于自由贸易的强国。英国内部的人在19世纪末提出来,就像是今天的美国一样,其中有一个典型的例子,就是约瑟夫张伯伦Joseph Chamberlain他曾经是英国著名的自由派政治家。

  19. S1来源 47:37–48:02目标 30:54–31:130.639

    来源片段

    In the late 19th century in Britain itself there was a minority current within conservative circles in particular that were espousing similar kind of paranoid critiques of the demise of British labor and industry but they were the minority current. I mean not to say that they weren't uninfluential and of course there's really interesting connections with what's going on there and the way that they're actually drawing on their understanding of the economic nationalist makeup of the world order.

    目标片段

    19世纪末,全球经济民族主义的崛起,也让很多支持过自由贸易的国家,开始对自由贸易提出质疑。播客的最后我想说,我觉得绝大多数评论当代政治事件的中国知识分子,他们最大的缺陷在于他们对于政治的视野过于狭窄,

  20. S2来源 40:30–41:00目标 7:43–8:150.650

    来源片段

    in the 18th century so John Wilkes refers to it in his kind of campaigns for for press freedom and it also gets invoked by radical movements in the late 18th and early 19th century so the London Corresponding Society members you know refer to Magna Carta as giving them the sort of authority for their campaigns for manhood suffrage and the same with the Chartists on into the 19th century. And I think there's you know there's a few things here that are going on here one is actually just the sort of the prominence of Magna Carta as a constitutional document and as a reference point.

    目标片段

    这些当时的这种自由贸易理论思想层出不穷,出现在18世纪晚期蓬勃发展。在19世纪这些都出现在哪都出现在英国,对吧?横更在这个国家,每个人生活当中的粮食法案,显然与这个自由贸易的理念是相互冲撞、互相违背的。于是我们来到了这段历史的起点1840年代左右的时候,英国爆发了一场由工人阶级和中产阶级联合发起的运动叫做Anti-Corn Law League.它的主要领导人就是反股物法案联盟。