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目标片段所以我们今天讨论的言论自由，这个想法是，人们普遍拥有所有人都普遍拥有针对公共事务发表私人意见的权利。
来源片段Well, our idea of free speech is concentrated on the notion that people have a general right to speak out on matters of public concern.
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来源片段
In that wider story, one of the questions is what we mean by free speech in the first place. As people use it today, it's often treated as a historical idea, some timeless idea. We know what we mean when we talk about free speech and the question is just are you for it or are you against it? But it is clearly not a timeless idea. It has a history and it also has a beginning. The idea of free speech had to be invented. It doesn't just exist out there in nature. Maybe to start, we should try and work out when the story starts. When do you think in a way that we would recognise the term, the idea of free speech comes from?
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因为在此时此刻，突然有越来越多的人开始在这个你支持，还是你反对这个态度变得越来越模棱两可。因为越来越多的人发现言论自由，好像并不是一个绝对的超越时间的普世真理，它并不是单纯的一件绝对的好事。此时此刻恰恰是一个绝佳的。你可以说松动土壤松动的时间点，让我们去重新回到我支持，还是我反对这个问题之前更基础的那个问题。那就是什么是言论自由、言论自由。这个概念的历史是什么？它的起源在哪里？它是怎么被发明出来的？
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That's an idea that only really emerges around 1700.
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这个想法一直到1700年之后才出现在人类社会中。
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It is true that before 1700, there are plenty of other notions of free speech.
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1700年之前，所有有关言论自由的讨论。
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You cannot talk about politics. Similarly, religious freedom of expression is always bounded by the principle that it shouldn't affect public affairs.
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这些大学内部的言论自由、学术自由不会延展到大学外部。以及我说的1700年之前的这些言论自由的根本原则是，他们不能影响公共事物，不能影响政治，
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This all changes around 1700.
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这些界限到了1700年左右开始发生根本性变化。
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That's a concept. So before that, people have exactly the opposite idea that speech as it's most powerful is more powerful than any physical violence.
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另外一方面，我想说的是，其实1700年之前的任何社会的普遍看法也是这样。他们的普遍看法是语言比物理暴力更具破坏性。
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And you find this throughout English literature. John Dunne has a wonderful similar saying, Burton in the early 17th century and the Anatomy of Melancholy makes a similar point.
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圣经旧约里面有一句著名的真言，他说，鞭子只能打击在肉体，而舌头却能够粉碎骨头。我们去看一整个英国文学传统早期英国文学传统John DonneRobert Burton写的那个忧郁的解剖Anatomy of Melancholy.
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The implication of that therefore is that people wouldn't go around thinking that there's such a thing as free violence. Violence is the sort of thing that should be just allowed on principle because it's a form of expression to be given free reign.
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那么在任何一个社会都不会有人主张暴力应该毫无限制，暴力自由不可能是一个我们应该普遍容忍的权利。如果所以说就到了这一步，如果你认为语言的力量可以上升到暴力，那就不会有人维护。
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So the earliest English law, for example, about fake news, false news as it's actually literally termed, dates from the 13th century.
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但是早在13世纪，英国就已经有了针对虚假新闻false news的法律，这是一个长久以来的社会焦虑。
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There was an equivalent explosion of print and some people at least trying to justify this, maybe not to theorise it, but to justify it. But it didn't last. Does that feed into this later period? Is there a sense that that earlier version of it was a kind of failed experiment in free speech? Not actually, no. So first of all, in that moment in the 1640s and 50s, most of the attention there is focused on arguing for greater liberty of religious speech and religious conscience. It's not so much about politics, although that does come into it a little bit in small ways. But the main effect of that is that in 1660, when the monarchy is restored, there's a huge backlash against the idea of just allowing people to print freely.
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因为如果你认为言论可以伤人言论是一种暴力，那么任由谣言和诽谤四处传播，它会不断壮大诱发行动。对于个人利益和公共利益造成伤害，我们等一会儿马上会讲1700年之后言论自由这个概念的普及。在这之前，我还想说，在1700年之前，英国内战期间，1640年到1650年代，英国有过一段非常短暂，但是没有持久影响力的有关言论。自由的辩论主要集中在宗教表达和良知自由层面，而不是政治言论，结果是什么呢？
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But the main effect of that is that in 1660, when the monarchy is restored, there's a huge backlash against the idea of just allowing people to print freely.
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就是1660年，王正复辟之后，对于这种言论，自由产生了强烈反弹。
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And so in 1660, you get an attempt to really circulate, regulate the printing press in particular. That only breaks down after the glorious revolution for contingent religious and political reasons.
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结果就是在1660年英国内战结束，王正复辟之后，政府大力收紧对于出版的控制，一直到1688年光荣革命之后，这种极其严苛的针对宗教言论和政治言论的管制才被迫终止。
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But then in 1721, these two journalists write this series of polemical tracts where they celebrate freedom of speech as the foundation of all liberty.
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这两个新闻记者在1721年用极其具有鼓动性的文风，宣扬言论自由是所有自由的基石，它的语言风格极其出色，
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And governments are always trying to amass too much power and to tyrannize and subdue their populations. And you should always be on your guard against such things.
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他们在那疯狂警告英国人，政府永远存在滥用权力的倾向。因此，民众必须保持时刻警惕，谁来帮助民众保持警惕。
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So this becomes the weapon of choice for anyone who wants to justify their own speech in the rest of the 18th century. Printers who want to justify printing stuff, opposition journalists, opposition politicians, it's a clarion call for freedom of speech.
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因此，在一整个18个世纪18世纪，这个家图书信成为了政府反对派印刷商、知识分子舆论记者的最爱。我们可以从这个家图书信强调的自由看到它有什么特点？
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That is, it is a freedom to express yourself in something that we would recognize as a public space. It's not a private freedom. Absolutely not.
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首先，它所想象的自由是一种公共性自由。公共领域中的自由，不包括私人表达的自由。
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But one basic way is that they always have this notion, this presumption that if you just allow people to debate freely, they will agree. And this comes out of the old Protestant ideas about religious dispute as well, that if only we have freedom, ultimately the truth will emerge.
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这些早期言论自由这个概念的拥躬。对于言论自由的辩护，还有另外一个重要基础，那就是他们相信真理将会通过更多言论自由自然显露，
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It's quite a narrow sphere, if you think about it in terms of the subject matter of free speech, around which presumably the assumption is people will agree when it is shown to them that this person is a rogue, that this person is a rogue. Exactly. I mean, there are lots of caveats in it about how, of course, freedom of expression, even within that narrow sphere, can cause damage, can cause riots, can cause, you know, honest people to be slandered. But one of the beauties of their rhetoric and their polemic is that they just wave all that away. They shunt that aside. And always the headline is, well, even if it does do those things, the greater good is served by just allowing it to happen.
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第二点，当然是大家更加熟悉的这个启蒙时代，对于普遍理性的信念，通过启蒙大众，我们可以让普遍理性、更加广泛的传播，更让社会变得更好。所以我们在这些早期言论自由辩护者中可以看到一种普遍的你可以说会让2025年的现代人感到有点陌生的乐观。比如说家族书信的这两个作者，这两个记者承认自由言论可能引发骚乱，可能诽谤无辜。但是他们坚称言论自由，就应该无条件被容许批评。当权者应该被无限度的宽容。即使有时候这些指控是不实的指控，我们也不必担心他们的主张，对吧？
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And an honest man, an honest governor has nothing to fear from lies, because they will be self-evidently exposed as untruths.
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他们主张诚实的官员无需害怕记者的诽谤，因为谎言最终会自我暴露。
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And it goes straight into the declarations of rights in 1776 that the states all put out claiming freedom of speech.
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Freedom of speech is the bulwark of liberty这一短语在1776年各州的权力宣言中被广泛引用，最终进入1789年的宪法文本。
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It's been articulated in terms of high principle. It has been institutionalized in a way in a very important document, the amendments to the United States Constitution.
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它在今天美国很多语境中不但被理论化成一种崇高原则，并且它在美国这个国家制度中已经被制度化了，它是第一修正案的根基。
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What changes in, well, we can give a date to it in 1859, in one of the key philosophical texts of the 19th century, written by one of the great philosophers of the 19th century, John Stuart Mill, is a new kind of articulation of the basic philosophical principle of freedom of speech, freedom of expression, freedom of conscience, freedom of belief.
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随着媒体革命成为现代英国人语境一部分之后，真正把这个概念言论自由上升到另外一个档次的是1859年John Storch Mill约翰·斯托尔特密尔发表的那本极具影响力的哲学著作《论自由 on liberty》今天我们想要讨论言论自由的起点，
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The core of the book On Liberty is that people should be free in their experiments and living, as he puts it somewhere, that people should be allowed to go through life and express their individuality in the ways that they see fit and not be cowed by the main thing he's concerned about. It's not governmental pressure, but social pressure, but social conformity.
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他的核心理念是个体，应该享有生活实验的自由。experiments in living,人们应该用自己认为合适的方式表达个性，表达自我不被社会压迫住，
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But they always more importantly stressed that this was about a common truth that people would, as the public in general, approach, especially in the political sphere. And James Mill, John Stuart Mill's father, had kind of taken this idea to extremes in his own theories of free speech.
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早期那些鼓吹言论自由的理论家虽然说也会谈及个体权利，但是他们最终的落脚点是公共真理，尤其是政治真理。而密尔则首次试图把言论自由建立在一种个人带有内在尊严的基本权利。
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What makes this distinctive, I think, is it's still about truth in some sense. This is an idea that by allowing people really radical freedom of expression and experiment in how they live.
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而是在于允许人们通过言论与生活方式的实践，接近某种理解，这种接近是自由生活的本质。为什么我要在上面强调早期对于言论自由的辩护者认为真理自带光辉？
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Goes back to Milton's religious expression of the idea that truth is so beautiful and so strong, so powerful. When she shows herself, humans automatically will choose her over untruth.
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这是密尔的前辈Milton的观点。米尔顿的观点，米尔顿相信真理和谬误在进行自由竞争的时候，真理一定会胜出。
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And I also clearly believe in their religious views, but they should be left to live in peace as long as they're not harming anyone else. That's the core of it.
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我不同意他们的宗教信仰。但是只要他们没有伤害，他人，就应该被允许按照自己的方式生活。
S1：3 个窗口回退
来源片段
So would another way of putting it be that he doesn't believe that people will cohere around something that we call the truth and the truth is a sort of beacon that's obscured and free speech will strip away the barriers to it. He doesn't believe that. And he absolutely believes that freedom of speech and expression includes the right to be wrong, completely wrong, and carry on being wrong. No one's going to let you be wrong on the path to being right. But he also believes that a world full of people, many of whom are wrong, will include the people who are right. Doesn't he believe that that it's not about agreement? I mean, he sort of occasionally seemed to think in political terms that there are versions of liberal politics where people might approach forms of agreement. But nonetheless, even in that context, they only do it if the people who are wrong are really allowed to be wrong in a very vocal and visible way.
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在米尔心中，人的观点，人的生活方式确实有好坏对错之分。但是为什么要允许满嘴屁话的人也要有言论自由呢？他认为，在这里又来到了让自由派热烈盈眶的普世真理。他认为，允许人们自由表达，哪怕是那些错的离谱的观点，允许人们自由表达，也能够创造一个更有可能包含正确观点的社会。换句话说，错的人越能够被允许发出声音，对的人就越有机会存在。
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But it is in order that you avoid the risk of stifling the people who are right. Isn't that still a part of Mill's argument? I think that is. I think that is. But as you express it there, I can see the tension between saying this is all good and this is an equilibrium that will lead to a flourishing society, which is sometimes what he's tending towards. And on the other hand, the danger that if too many people believe the wrong things, then you might have harmful consequences for the society as a whole. And he's constantly trying to tack between the two. And this might be a good point to bring in the way in which this is at a meta level, a problematic argument and a problematic text, because he's talking here explicitly and there's an extraordinary paragraph where he sets this out very explicitly, only about advanced societies.
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换句话说，错的人越能够被允许发出声音，对的人就越有机会存在。米尔不相信言论自由的结果是让社会达到普遍共识。他甚至不认为言论自由能够带来社会和谐。他自己也清楚的指出，如果我们允许这些谎言阴谋论、假新闻错误观点在社会上自由传播，可能确实会带来更多混乱偏见，甚至社会危害。但是比起压制他们比起压制错误，他更担心的是，这个社会对于正确声音的扼杀。因此他认为一个健康的社会必须要容忍错误，容忍蠢蠢淡。
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And they can only advance in his terminology through a form of Western despotism. That's why the British are there in his view. He spends his life in the employ of the East India Company. He's their main propagandist. So he's a died-in-the-world imperialist. And this affects his theory of speech because in those societies, he believes that allowing freedom of expression is out of the question, because these people won't be able to benefit from it. They are not intellectually adult enough to be allowed to discuss things freely and thereby to intellectually advance individually and collectively. He thinks only the societies of Germany and England and France and so on have got to that stage and now should be allowed to be free to do that and further advance.
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换句话说，不是所有人都配拥有言论自由，在他心中的不文明社会，不配拥有言论自由不成熟的社会，就是不文明的社会。你把这个言论自由给这些人，他们也只能够滥用言论自由，他们不具备言论自由所需要的理性与责任。在他心中，这些文明人当然包括了女人了。米尔话说，差一句话，米尔爱上了一个已婚妇女Hariot这两个人都是早期女性投票权的倡导者。话说回文明人在他心中，文明人在当时主要是英国人、德国人和法国人在他心中排除的是什么？当然是英国殖民地的印度人，在他心中你没有具备言论自由所需的承担这些责任的能力。
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I like what you're doing as an intellectual argument, but I also, I mean, admiration, I mean, speechless admiration for your attempt to ascribe to JD Vance some kind of intellectual hinterland when he made these statements. I think what they more clearly show is that freedom of speech has always been a weaponized slogan that people wield to support expressions of opinion that they are for.
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在当时是一个异端知识分子，他把言论问题都推导为是个体对于社会压迫的抵抗，他试图建构，一个能够容许他这样异端知识分子发表言论的社会，我觉得这个出发点是极其值得尊重和同情的。
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But I mean, as a historian, there are two things I'd like to say. One is we're living through a media revolution. We have been for the last few decades, and that's always been the case when you see people agitating and arguing, especially fiercely about free speech. That's where the first arguments about political free speech began in the media revolution of the early 18th century, then Mill and other theorists of the 19th century talking about, again, the telegraph, the speed of communication, the daily news press of the 19th century is again a phenomenon that people felt was revolutionary and the same as true for us.
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每当社会经历信息传播结构的剧烈变动的时候，围绕言论自由的讨论就会变得格外激烈。18世纪初期正是如此。当时他们面临的是印刷审查制度崩溃。新闻出版激增政治言论首次走向大众化19世纪中叶也有类似的趋势。电报的出现，日常新闻的出现，日报的出现，信息速度和广度空前发达。而我们当下的数字革命也是这样的一个转折点。所以在这个契机，我们回顾言论自由是如何伴随着媒体革命出现在我们的视野中，我觉得这格外有意思。